Pack wanted to buy

tramping packs dont tend to be waterproof, you put a packliner in them for waterproofness

Stick with brands that have a good warranty. Osprey has the "All Mighty Guarantee" which they actually honour. I have several of their packs as they are lighter than some other brands but this also means the odd one can creak under heavier loads. http://www.ospreypacks.com/us/en/customer-support/all-mighty-guarantee Macpac make wonderful packs too, but are heavier. Made to last as a rule and they will repair any damage or defects without too much headache. I didn't find their fitting service all that good so finding a knowledgable staff member would be priority. Vaude is a solid reliable brand, but I can't speak for their overnight packs as I only have their daypack size. Same goes for Exped. Good luck with your search...

I suggest doing the rounds of the main tramping stores, the big ones include Biviouac, Macpac and Torpedo7. I think Lowe Alpine also has a store in Auckland now, plus is widely stocked by independent retailers. A proper fitting pack makes a massive difference, although you probably would also have one which your kids can grow into. There are dozens of quality pack brands. Alternatively keep a eye on trademe, might be able to pick up a used pack for $20-50.. Just have to take care making sure the size is suitable.

Yeah, I wouldn't worry so much about waterproofness of a pack. Few are truly waterproof, and I've long long since not bothered with rain covers too. Instead using waterproof bags inside for the essentials, sleeping bag etc., and plastic bags. As the guys have said fit is so important. Also look for features, I like ability to take a hydration pack, and I'm keen on hip belt pockets too.

Be careful with hipbelt pockets and what way the zip go, else they can open on you if you aren't careful and you can lose stuff.

It depends on what you want to do. If you are doing overnighters and are sticking to the trails, then something like the Osprey Atmos 50L or Macpac Torlesse 50L should do the job (both pretty light). If you see yourself taking on longer walks on trails then go for the 65L versions of the same packs. If you want to leave the trails and go bushwaking then you'll need something that's more durable and heavier. The Macpac Cascade or one of the Cactus (expensive) packs. I'd suggest you not go for anything larger than 65L, unless you have older bulkier gear or want to be out for more than a week. Also, wait for the specials as they can knock a few hundie off the price. For waterproofing, get an inner somewhere like Macpac. I use a pack cover in tandem with this, unless the wind is too strong for it. It's best to go to the shops and try many packs on, rather than buy blindly over the net.

"It's best to go to the shops and try many packs on, rather than buy blindly over the net." Very true fit is far more important than brand. I like my Macpac Torlese 70l but that doesnt make it the perfect pack for someone else.

Thanks for all your answers. We did visit some shops today. Tried on a few packs. The Torlese 50 was a nice fit and was my favourite. The sale is still on for another week yet so time to decide. Yes I now understand the waterproof factor. I just asked as I do have a huge old school pack that is quite waterproof in all but the heaviest rain but is really too big for the boys to carry.

50L is a good size but limits the time you may want to spend tramping and the option of carrying a tent. I'm not a big fan of carrying tents on the outside but each to their own on that one. 65L is more versatile as it has the space should you need it. Sounds like your boys are quite young so you could be carrying a bit of gear for them too?